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C. E. White1

External


Since: Apr 13, 2004
Posts: 332



(Msg. 1) Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 12:53 pm
Post subject: Tundra owners grumble over rumble
Archived from groups: alt>autos>toyota, others (more info?)

Tundra owners grumble over rumble

Mark Rechtin
Automotive News
October 22, 2007 - 12:01 am ET

LOS ANGELES - Toyota's Tundra pickup was hit with a double whammy last week.

Angry consumers are peppering the Internet with complaints that the torque
converter in the 2007 Tundra's six-speed transmission has problems
disengaging during gearshifts - a problem that Toyota acknowledges.

Meanwhile, the Tundra 4x4 model took a broadside from Consumer Reports
magazine, which rated it "below average" in projected reliability.

Toyota thought it had put the redesigned Tundra's teething problems in the
rearview mirror. First there was a batch of defective camshafts. Then it
received a four-star rating in NHTSA crash tests, one star less than its
Detroit rivals.

The latest quality snarl involves a vibration coming from the transmission
when changing gears under gentle acceleration or deceleration.

Toyota Motor Sales officials have nicknamed the problem "the rumble strip"
because the slippage causes vibration similar to the sensation of driving
over the wake-up strips at the side of highways.

The rumbling usually lasts several seconds. But the problem sometimes
worsens to the point that some owners can't shift into certain gears.

The problem has been reported only in six-speed transmissions, which are
linked to the popular 5.7-liter V-8 engine. Since the 2007 Tundra's February
launch, the 5.7-liter engine has been installed in 70 percent of about
135,000 Tundras sold. That means the problem could affect nearly 100,000
vehicles.

Tundra travails
Since its February launch, Toyota's full-sized pickup has taken some hits
related to quality.

Bad batch of camshafts

Crash rating below rivals'

Consumer Reports snub

Faulty torque converters

Bad torque converter
Before Toyota's technical service department traced the problem to the
torque converter, some Toyota dealers replaced entire transmissions, said
Toyota spokesman John Hanson. If the vibration occurs now, likely only the
torque converter will be replaced.

Toyota still is trying to trace what exactly is wrong with the torque
converter.

Internal field reports have yet to show anyone stranded by the problem,
Hanson said. But Tundra owners in several Internet chat rooms say their
transmissions quit shifting properly, forcing them to limp the truck to a
dealership. The rumble-strip effect often occurs within the first 1,000
miles of ownership.

Isolated instances
Pickup owners are especially particular about vehicle reliability, says Mike
Levine, editor of the consumer Internet site pickuptruck.com.

Since Toyota staked its reputation on reliability, any problem makes it
tougher for Toyota to persuade domestic loyalists to switch allegiances,
Levine said.

Reports of the problem have been sporadic. Large dealers in northern
California, Texas and Ohio said they had no reported owner complaints about
Tundra transmissions. An executive for a group of Midwestern dealerships,
speaking anonymously, said his mechanics had seen one or two instances.

Craig Whetter, executive vice president of Wilson Automotive Group, says the
group's six Toyota stores in California and Arizona have sold 2,236 Tundras
this year but have not seen a single bad torque converter.

"These guys haven't turned a bolt on one, let alone replaced one," Whetter
said.

Of bigger concern to Toyota is the number of vehicles affected.

The faulty camshaft problem was limited to several hundred early-build
vehicles, but owners of Tundras built as recently as September have
complained of defective transmissions.

The torque converter for the six-speed transmission used with the 5.7-liter
V-8 is built at an Aisin AW plant in Durham, N.C. Aisin officials declined
to comment, referring interview requests to Toyota.

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badgolferman2

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Since: Sep 01, 2004
Posts: 526



(Msg. 2) Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:00 pm
Post subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

C. E. White, 10/22/2007,8:53:41 AM, wrote:

> Tundra owners grumble over rumble
>
> Mark Rechtin
> Automotive News
> October 22, 2007 - 12:01 am ET
>
> LOS ANGELES - Toyota's Tundra pickup was hit with a double whammy
> last week.
>
> Angry consumers are peppering the Internet with complaints that the
> torque converter in the 2007 Tundra's six-speed transmission has
> problems disengaging during gearshifts - a problem that Toyota
> acknowledges.
>
> Meanwhile, the Tundra 4x4 model took a broadside from Consumer
> Reports magazine, which rated it "below average" in projected
> reliability.
>
> Toyota thought it had put the redesigned Tundra's teething problems
> in the rearview mirror. First there was a batch of defective
> camshafts. Then it received a four-star rating in NHTSA crash tests,
> one star less than its Detroit rivals.
>
> The latest quality snarl involves a vibration coming from the
> transmission when changing gears under gentle acceleration or
> deceleration.
>
> Toyota Motor Sales officials have nicknamed the problem "the rumble
> strip" because the slippage causes vibration similar to the sensation
> of driving over the wake-up strips at the side of highways.
>
> The rumbling usually lasts several seconds. But the problem sometimes
> worsens to the point that some owners can't shift into certain gears.
>
> The problem has been reported only in six-speed transmissions, which
> are linked to the popular 5.7-liter V-8 engine. Since the 2007
> Tundra's February launch, the 5.7-liter engine has been installed in
> 70 percent of about 135,000 Tundras sold. That means the problem
> could affect nearly 100,000 vehicles.
>
> Tundra travails
> Since its February launch, Toyota's full-sized pickup has taken some
> hits related to quality.
>
> Bad batch of camshafts
>
> Crash rating below rivals'
>
> Consumer Reports snub
>
> Faulty torque converters
>
> Bad torque converter
> Before Toyota's technical service department traced the problem to
> the torque converter, some Toyota dealers replaced entire
> transmissions, said Toyota spokesman John Hanson. If the vibration
> occurs now, likely only the torque converter will be replaced.
>
> Toyota still is trying to trace what exactly is wrong with the torque
> converter.
>
> Internal field reports have yet to show anyone stranded by the
> problem, Hanson said. But Tundra owners in several Internet chat
> rooms say their transmissions quit shifting properly, forcing them to
> limp the truck to a dealership. The rumble-strip effect often occurs
> within the first 1,000 miles of ownership.
>
> Isolated instances
> Pickup owners are especially particular about vehicle reliability,
> says Mike Levine, editor of the consumer Internet site
> pickuptruck.com.
>
> Since Toyota staked its reputation on reliability, any problem makes
> it tougher for Toyota to persuade domestic loyalists to switch
> allegiances, Levine said.
>
> Reports of the problem have been sporadic. Large dealers in northern
> California, Texas and Ohio said they had no reported owner complaints
> about Tundra transmissions. An executive for a group of Midwestern
> dealerships, speaking anonymously, said his mechanics had seen one or
> two instances.
>
> Craig Whetter, executive vice president of Wilson Automotive Group,
> says the group's six Toyota stores in California and Arizona have
> sold 2,236 Tundras this year but have not seen a single bad torque
> converter.
>
> "These guys haven't turned a bolt on one, let alone replaced one,"
> Whetter said.
>
> Of bigger concern to Toyota is the number of vehicles affected.
>
> The faulty camshaft problem was limited to several hundred
> early-build vehicles, but owners of Tundras built as recently as
> September have complained of defective transmissions.
>
> The torque converter for the six-speed transmission used with the
> 5.7-liter V-8 is built at an Aisin AW plant in Durham, N.C. Aisin
> officials declined to comment, referring interview requests to Toyota.

I'm not completeley surprised by all this quality slipping news coming
out lately. Although I am still a Toyota loyalist I have personally
noticed the quality of the controls, road noise, inside material and
other non-essential parts. All Toyotas I have owned since my 1994
Camry just don't measure up in feel or driving experience.

All that said I would still choose a Toyota over almost any brand just
because everything under the skin and cabin lasts for such a long time
without needing repair.

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C. E. White1

External


Since: Apr 13, 2004
Posts: 332



(Msg. 3) Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:37 pm
Post subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"badgolferman" wrote in message


> I'm not completeley surprised by all this quality slipping news coming
> out lately. Although I am still a Toyota loyalist I have personally
> noticed the quality of the controls, road noise, inside material and
> other non-essential parts. All Toyotas I have owned since my 1994
> Camry just don't measure up in feel or driving experience.
>
> All that said I would still choose a Toyota over almost any brand just
> because everything under the skin and cabin lasts for such a long time
> without needing repair.

I don't think this problem is really that big a deal. Toyota has had
problems like ever other manufacturer for years. However, in many cases they
get the bugs out in other markets before selling the product in the US. The
new Tundra has quite a few US unique componets (5.7L engine, 6 speed truck
transmission). Because of this, the US market is doing the debugging. I
only know one person who has a "new" Tundra and he seems happy - but then
the biggest thing he likely to haul is groceries. I am seeing a lot more big
Tundras around. It seems to be a moderate hit with the "I don't really need
a truck, but want one crowd." The hard bed cover and chrome brush guards are
clear indicators that it is a hit with the poser crowd. I have yet to see
one outside of a Toyota commerical hauling anything at all (even a boat).

Anyhow, both Ford and Dodge had problems with shuttering torque convertors
in the recent past. The camshaft problems seems to have been an early
teething problem that has been resolved.

Ed
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Chips

External


Since: Oct 22, 2007
Posts: 5



(Msg. 4) Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:00 pm
Post subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Interesting that article states "the new Tundra owners have been peppering
the internet with complaints".

Am I missing something, or is there not one single "new" Tundra complaint on
this NG?

The older Tundra, like what I have (2002) had brake issues, tranny issues,
various other things that showed up here.

GC

"C. E. White" wrote in message

> Tundra owners grumble over rumble
>
> Mark Rechtin
> Automotive News
> October 22, 2007 - 12:01 am ET
>
> LOS ANGELES - Toyota's Tundra pickup was hit with a double whammy last
> week.
>
> Angry consumers are peppering the Internet with complaints that the torque
> converter in the 2007 Tundra's six-speed transmission has problems
> disengaging during gearshifts - a problem that Toyota acknowledges.
>
> Meanwhile, the Tundra 4x4 model took a broadside from Consumer Reports
> magazine, which rated it "below average" in projected reliability.
>
> Toyota thought it had put the redesigned Tundra's teething problems in the
> rearview mirror. First there was a batch of defective camshafts. Then it
> received a four-star rating in NHTSA crash tests, one star less than its
> Detroit rivals.
>
> The latest quality snarl involves a vibration coming from the transmission
> when changing gears under gentle acceleration or deceleration.
>
> Toyota Motor Sales officials have nicknamed the problem "the rumble strip"
> because the slippage causes vibration similar to the sensation of driving
> over the wake-up strips at the side of highways.
>
> The rumbling usually lasts several seconds. But the problem sometimes
> worsens to the point that some owners can't shift into certain gears.
>
> The problem has been reported only in six-speed transmissions, which are
> linked to the popular 5.7-liter V-8 engine. Since the 2007 Tundra's
> February launch, the 5.7-liter engine has been installed in 70 percent of
> about 135,000 Tundras sold. That means the problem could affect nearly
> 100,000 vehicles.
>
> Tundra travails
> Since its February launch, Toyota's full-sized pickup has taken some hits
> related to quality.
>
> Bad batch of camshafts
>
> Crash rating below rivals'
>
> Consumer Reports snub
>
> Faulty torque converters
>
> Bad torque converter
> Before Toyota's technical service department traced the problem to the
> torque converter, some Toyota dealers replaced entire transmissions, said
> Toyota spokesman John Hanson. If the vibration occurs now, likely only the
> torque converter will be replaced.
>
> Toyota still is trying to trace what exactly is wrong with the torque
> converter.
>
> Internal field reports have yet to show anyone stranded by the problem,
> Hanson said. But Tundra owners in several Internet chat rooms say their
> transmissions quit shifting properly, forcing them to limp the truck to a
> dealership. The rumble-strip effect often occurs within the first 1,000
> miles of ownership.
>
> Isolated instances
> Pickup owners are especially particular about vehicle reliability, says
> Mike Levine, editor of the consumer Internet site pickuptruck.com.
>
> Since Toyota staked its reputation on reliability, any problem makes it
> tougher for Toyota to persuade domestic loyalists to switch allegiances,
> Levine said.
>
> Reports of the problem have been sporadic. Large dealers in northern
> California, Texas and Ohio said they had no reported owner complaints
> about Tundra transmissions. An executive for a group of Midwestern
> dealerships, speaking anonymously, said his mechanics had seen one or two
> instances.
>
> Craig Whetter, executive vice president of Wilson Automotive Group, says
> the group's six Toyota stores in California and Arizona have sold 2,236
> Tundras this year but have not seen a single bad torque converter.
>
> "These guys haven't turned a bolt on one, let alone replaced one," Whetter
> said.
>
> Of bigger concern to Toyota is the number of vehicles affected.
>
> The faulty camshaft problem was limited to several hundred early-build
> vehicles, but owners of Tundras built as recently as September have
> complained of defective transmissions.
>
> The torque converter for the six-speed transmission used with the
> 5.7-liter V-8 is built at an Aisin AW plant in Durham, N.C. Aisin
> officials declined to comment, referring interview requests to Toyota.
>
 >> Stay informed about: Tundra owners grumble over rumble 
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C. E. White1

External


Since: Apr 13, 2004
Posts: 332



(Msg. 5) Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 7:43 pm
Post subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

----- Original Message -----
From: "Chips"
Newsgroups: alt.autos.toyota,alt.autos.toyota.trucks
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 2:00 PM
Subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble


> Interesting that article states "the new Tundra owners have been peppering
> the internet with complaints".
>
> Am I missing something, or is there not one single "new" Tundra complaint
> on this NG?

I actually thought the same thing. There were a couple of other things that
bothered me - 1) I don't think a torque converter can disengage during a
shift - maybe they meant the torque converter clutch; 2) I doubt that the
actual torque convertors are made in Durham (the transmissions are made
there), 3) I don't think must truck owner are especially particular about
reliability.

In defense of the article, I will say that usenet is no longer the primary
tool people use to discuss problems. Most people I know prefer other types
of forums. Here are a few other forums where problems are discussed:

http://www.tundraheadquarters.com/blog/2007/08/22/all-known-2007-toyot...undra-p
http://www.tundrasolutions.com/forums/tundra/114436-tundra-tailgate-fa...res-i-a
http://www.tundrasolutions.com/forums/tundra/113646-transmission-fault...entifie
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f1669aa
http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/news/toyota/tundra/transmissions/page1.html

I think you can find enough mention of problems to qualify as "peppering the
internet with complaints."

Ed
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Mike Hunter

External


Since: Sep 16, 2005
Posts: 1536



(Msg. 6) Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:09 pm
Post subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

That's understandable domestic trucks are very reliable trucks. When Toyota
said 'this changes everything' they were referring to the Tundra finally
getting closer to domestic trucks in build quality.

The Tundra is a far better truck than anything Toyota sold before but it
seems they still have a way to go to come close to Ford, GM and Dodge
full-size trucks in build quality

mike


"C. E. White" wrote in message

> Tundra owners grumble over rumble
>
> Mark Rechtin
> Automotive News
> October 22, 2007 - 12:01 am ET
>
> LOS ANGELES - Toyota's Tundra pickup was hit with a double whammy last
> week.
>
> Angry consumers are peppering the Internet with complaints that the torque
> converter in the 2007 Tundra's six-speed transmission has problems
> disengaging during gearshifts - a problem that Toyota acknowledges.
>
> Meanwhile, the Tundra 4x4 model took a broadside from Consumer Reports
> magazine, which rated it "below average" in projected reliability.
>
> Toyota thought it had put the redesigned Tundra's teething problems in the
> rearview mirror. First there was a batch of defective camshafts. Then it
> received a four-star rating in NHTSA crash tests, one star less than its
> Detroit rivals.
>
> The latest quality snarl involves a vibration coming from the transmission
> when changing gears under gentle acceleration or deceleration.
>
> Toyota Motor Sales officials have nicknamed the problem "the rumble strip"
> because the slippage causes vibration similar to the sensation of driving
> over the wake-up strips at the side of highways.
>
> The rumbling usually lasts several seconds. But the problem sometimes
> worsens to the point that some owners can't shift into certain gears.
>
> The problem has been reported only in six-speed transmissions, which are
> linked to the popular 5.7-liter V-8 engine. Since the 2007 Tundra's
> February launch, the 5.7-liter engine has been installed in 70 percent of
> about 135,000 Tundras sold. That means the problem could affect nearly
> 100,000 vehicles.
>
> Tundra travails
> Since its February launch, Toyota's full-sized pickup has taken some hits
> related to quality.
>
> Bad batch of camshafts
>
> Crash rating below rivals'
>
> Consumer Reports snub
>
> Faulty torque converters
>
> Bad torque converter
> Before Toyota's technical service department traced the problem to the
> torque converter, some Toyota dealers replaced entire transmissions, said
> Toyota spokesman John Hanson. If the vibration occurs now, likely only the
> torque converter will be replaced.
>
> Toyota still is trying to trace what exactly is wrong with the torque
> converter.
>
> Internal field reports have yet to show anyone stranded by the problem,
> Hanson said. But Tundra owners in several Internet chat rooms say their
> transmissions quit shifting properly, forcing them to limp the truck to a
> dealership. The rumble-strip effect often occurs within the first 1,000
> miles of ownership.
>
> Isolated instances
> Pickup owners are especially particular about vehicle reliability, says
> Mike Levine, editor of the consumer Internet site pickuptruck.com.
>
> Since Toyota staked its reputation on reliability, any problem makes it
> tougher for Toyota to persuade domestic loyalists to switch allegiances,
> Levine said.
>
> Reports of the problem have been sporadic. Large dealers in northern
> California, Texas and Ohio said they had no reported owner complaints
> about Tundra transmissions. An executive for a group of Midwestern
> dealerships, speaking anonymously, said his mechanics had seen one or two
> instances.
>
> Craig Whetter, executive vice president of Wilson Automotive Group, says
> the group's six Toyota stores in California and Arizona have sold 2,236
> Tundras this year but have not seen a single bad torque converter.
>
> "These guys haven't turned a bolt on one, let alone replaced one," Whetter
> said.
>
> Of bigger concern to Toyota is the number of vehicles affected.
>
> The faulty camshaft problem was limited to several hundred early-build
> vehicles, but owners of Tundras built as recently as September have
> complained of defective transmissions.
>
> The torque converter for the six-speed transmission used with the
> 5.7-liter V-8 is built at an Aisin AW plant in Durham, N.C. Aisin
> officials declined to comment, referring interview requests to Toyota.
>
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Mike Hunter

External


Since: Sep 16, 2005
Posts: 1536



(Msg. 7) Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:11 pm
Post subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Even Toyotas race cars are pulled to the track by domestic trucks, mot Fords

mike

"C. E. White" wrote in message

>
> "badgolferman" wrote in message
>
>
>> I'm not completeley surprised by all this quality slipping news coming
>> out lately. Although I am still a Toyota loyalist I have personally
>> noticed the quality of the controls, road noise, inside material and
>> other non-essential parts. All Toyotas I have owned since my 1994
>> Camry just don't measure up in feel or driving experience.
>>
>> All that said I would still choose a Toyota over almost any brand just
>> because everything under the skin and cabin lasts for such a long time
>> without needing repair.
>
> I don't think this problem is really that big a deal. Toyota has had
> problems like ever other manufacturer for years. However, in many cases
> they get the bugs out in other markets before selling the product in the
> US. The new Tundra has quite a few US unique componets (5.7L engine, 6
> speed truck transmission). Because of this, the US market is doing the
> debugging. I only know one person who has a "new" Tundra and he seems
> happy - but then the biggest thing he likely to haul is groceries. I am
> seeing a lot more big Tundras around. It seems to be a moderate hit with
> the "I don't really need a truck, but want one crowd." The hard bed cover
> and chrome brush guards are clear indicators that it is a hit with the
> poser crowd. I have yet to see one outside of a Toyota commerical hauling
> anything at all (even a boat).
>
> Anyhow, both Ford and Dodge had problems with shuttering torque convertors
> in the recent past. The camshaft problems seems to have been an early
> teething problem that has been resolved.
>
> Ed
>
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Mike Hunter

External


Since: Sep 16, 2005
Posts: 1536



(Msg. 8) Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:14 pm
Post subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Toyota needs to sell a hell of a lot more Tundras for the problematic ones
to start to show up as complaint in a NG. The only sell around 5% of the
trucks sold in the US Wink

mike


"Chips" wrote in message

> Interesting that article states "the new Tundra owners have been peppering
> the internet with complaints".
>
> Am I missing something, or is there not one single "new" Tundra complaint
> on this NG?
>
> The older Tundra, like what I have (2002) had brake issues, tranny issues,
> various other things that showed up here.
>
> GC
>
> "C. E. White" wrote in message
>
>> Tundra owners grumble over rumble
>>
>> Mark Rechtin
>> Automotive News
>> October 22, 2007 - 12:01 am ET
>>
>> LOS ANGELES - Toyota's Tundra pickup was hit with a double whammy last
>> week.
>>
>> Angry consumers are peppering the Internet with complaints that the
>> torque converter in the 2007 Tundra's six-speed transmission has problems
>> disengaging during gearshifts - a problem that Toyota acknowledges.
>>
>> Meanwhile, the Tundra 4x4 model took a broadside from Consumer Reports
>> magazine, which rated it "below average" in projected reliability.
>>
>> Toyota thought it had put the redesigned Tundra's teething problems in
>> the rearview mirror. First there was a batch of defective camshafts. Then
>> it received a four-star rating in NHTSA crash tests, one star less than
>> its Detroit rivals.
>>
>> The latest quality snarl involves a vibration coming from the
>> transmission when changing gears under gentle acceleration or
>> deceleration.
>>
>> Toyota Motor Sales officials have nicknamed the problem "the rumble
>> strip" because the slippage causes vibration similar to the sensation of
>> driving over the wake-up strips at the side of highways.
>>
>> The rumbling usually lasts several seconds. But the problem sometimes
>> worsens to the point that some owners can't shift into certain gears.
>>
>> The problem has been reported only in six-speed transmissions, which are
>> linked to the popular 5.7-liter V-8 engine. Since the 2007 Tundra's
>> February launch, the 5.7-liter engine has been installed in 70 percent of
>> about 135,000 Tundras sold. That means the problem could affect nearly
>> 100,000 vehicles.
>>
>> Tundra travails
>> Since its February launch, Toyota's full-sized pickup has taken some hits
>> related to quality.
>>
>> Bad batch of camshafts
>>
>> Crash rating below rivals'
>>
>> Consumer Reports snub
>>
>> Faulty torque converters
>>
>> Bad torque converter
>> Before Toyota's technical service department traced the problem to the
>> torque converter, some Toyota dealers replaced entire transmissions, said
>> Toyota spokesman John Hanson. If the vibration occurs now, likely only
>> the torque converter will be replaced.
>>
>> Toyota still is trying to trace what exactly is wrong with the torque
>> converter.
>>
>> Internal field reports have yet to show anyone stranded by the problem,
>> Hanson said. But Tundra owners in several Internet chat rooms say their
>> transmissions quit shifting properly, forcing them to limp the truck to a
>> dealership. The rumble-strip effect often occurs within the first 1,000
>> miles of ownership.
>>
>> Isolated instances
>> Pickup owners are especially particular about vehicle reliability, says
>> Mike Levine, editor of the consumer Internet site pickuptruck.com.
>>
>> Since Toyota staked its reputation on reliability, any problem makes it
>> tougher for Toyota to persuade domestic loyalists to switch allegiances,
>> Levine said.
>>
>> Reports of the problem have been sporadic. Large dealers in northern
>> California, Texas and Ohio said they had no reported owner complaints
>> about Tundra transmissions. An executive for a group of Midwestern
>> dealerships, speaking anonymously, said his mechanics had seen one or two
>> instances.
>>
>> Craig Whetter, executive vice president of Wilson Automotive Group, says
>> the group's six Toyota stores in California and Arizona have sold 2,236
>> Tundras this year but have not seen a single bad torque converter.
>>
>> "These guys haven't turned a bolt on one, let alone replaced one,"
>> Whetter said.
>>
>> Of bigger concern to Toyota is the number of vehicles affected.
>>
>> The faulty camshaft problem was limited to several hundred early-build
>> vehicles, but owners of Tundras built as recently as September have
>> complained of defective transmissions.
>>
>> The torque converter for the six-speed transmission used with the
>> 5.7-liter V-8 is built at an Aisin AW plant in Durham, N.C. Aisin
>> officials declined to comment, referring interview requests to Toyota.
>>
>
>
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Mike Hunter

External


Since: Sep 16, 2005
Posts: 1536



(Msg. 9) Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Really? Then why is it Toyota had more recalls than any other manufacturer
in 2006 and again so far in 2007?


mike


"badgolferman" wrote in message

> C. E. White, 10/22/2007,8:53:41 AM, wrote:
>
>> Tundra owners grumble over rumble
>>
>> Mark Rechtin
>> Automotive News
>> October 22, 2007 - 12:01 am ET
>>
>> LOS ANGELES - Toyota's Tundra pickup was hit with a double whammy
>> last week.
>>
>> Angry consumers are peppering the Internet with complaints that the
>> torque converter in the 2007 Tundra's six-speed transmission has
>> problems disengaging during gearshifts - a problem that Toyota
>> acknowledges.
>>
>> Meanwhile, the Tundra 4x4 model took a broadside from Consumer
>> Reports magazine, which rated it "below average" in projected
>> reliability.
>>
>> Toyota thought it had put the redesigned Tundra's teething problems
>> in the rearview mirror. First there was a batch of defective
>> camshafts. Then it received a four-star rating in NHTSA crash tests,
>> one star less than its Detroit rivals.
>>
>> The latest quality snarl involves a vibration coming from the
>> transmission when changing gears under gentle acceleration or
>> deceleration.
>>
>> Toyota Motor Sales officials have nicknamed the problem "the rumble
>> strip" because the slippage causes vibration similar to the sensation
>> of driving over the wake-up strips at the side of highways.
>>
>> The rumbling usually lasts several seconds. But the problem sometimes
>> worsens to the point that some owners can't shift into certain gears.
>>
>> The problem has been reported only in six-speed transmissions, which
>> are linked to the popular 5.7-liter V-8 engine. Since the 2007
>> Tundra's February launch, the 5.7-liter engine has been installed in
>> 70 percent of about 135,000 Tundras sold. That means the problem
>> could affect nearly 100,000 vehicles.
>>
>> Tundra travails
>> Since its February launch, Toyota's full-sized pickup has taken some
>> hits related to quality.
>>
>> Bad batch of camshafts
>>
>> Crash rating below rivals'
>>
>> Consumer Reports snub
>>
>> Faulty torque converters
>>
>> Bad torque converter
>> Before Toyota's technical service department traced the problem to
>> the torque converter, some Toyota dealers replaced entire
>> transmissions, said Toyota spokesman John Hanson. If the vibration
>> occurs now, likely only the torque converter will be replaced.
>>
>> Toyota still is trying to trace what exactly is wrong with the torque
>> converter.
>>
>> Internal field reports have yet to show anyone stranded by the
>> problem, Hanson said. But Tundra owners in several Internet chat
>> rooms say their transmissions quit shifting properly, forcing them to
>> limp the truck to a dealership. The rumble-strip effect often occurs
>> within the first 1,000 miles of ownership.
>>
>> Isolated instances
>> Pickup owners are especially particular about vehicle reliability,
>> says Mike Levine, editor of the consumer Internet site
>> pickuptruck.com.
>>
>> Since Toyota staked its reputation on reliability, any problem makes
>> it tougher for Toyota to persuade domestic loyalists to switch
>> allegiances, Levine said.
>>
>> Reports of the problem have been sporadic. Large dealers in northern
>> California, Texas and Ohio said they had no reported owner complaints
>> about Tundra transmissions. An executive for a group of Midwestern
>> dealerships, speaking anonymously, said his mechanics had seen one or
>> two instances.
>>
>> Craig Whetter, executive vice president of Wilson Automotive Group,
>> says the group's six Toyota stores in California and Arizona have
>> sold 2,236 Tundras this year but have not seen a single bad torque
>> converter.
>>
>> "These guys haven't turned a bolt on one, let alone replaced one,"
>> Whetter said.
>>
>> Of bigger concern to Toyota is the number of vehicles affected.
>>
>> The faulty camshaft problem was limited to several hundred
>> early-build vehicles, but owners of Tundras built as recently as
>> September have complained of defective transmissions.
>>
>> The torque converter for the six-speed transmission used with the
>> 5.7-liter V-8 is built at an Aisin AW plant in Durham, N.C. Aisin
>> officials declined to comment, referring interview requests to Toyota.
>
> I'm not completeley surprised by all this quality slipping news coming
> out lately. Although I am still a Toyota loyalist I have personally
> noticed the quality of the controls, road noise, inside material and
> other non-essential parts. All Toyotas I have owned since my 1994
> Camry just don't measure up in feel or driving experience.
>
> All that said I would still choose a Toyota over almost any brand just
> because everything under the skin and cabin lasts for such a long time
> without needing repair.
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Chips

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Since: Oct 22, 2007
Posts: 5



(Msg. 10) Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 10:27 am
Post subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Yeah, that could be. The web forums have better controls for the spamming
that goes on in the usenets.

Thanks for those links.

GC

"C. E. White" wrote in message

>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Chips"
> Newsgroups: alt.autos.toyota,alt.autos.toyota.trucks
> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 2:00 PM
> Subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble
>
>
>> Interesting that article states "the new Tundra owners have been
>> peppering the internet with complaints".
>>
>> Am I missing something, or is there not one single "new" Tundra complaint
>> on this NG?
>
> I actually thought the same thing. There were a couple of other things
> that bothered me - 1) I don't think a torque converter can disengage
> during a shift - maybe they meant the torque converter clutch; 2) I doubt
> that the actual torque convertors are made in Durham (the transmissions
> are made there), 3) I don't think must truck owner are especially
> particular about reliability.
>
> In defense of the article, I will say that usenet is no longer the primary
> tool people use to discuss problems. Most people I know prefer other types
> of forums. Here are a few other forums where problems are discussed:
>
> http://www.tundraheadquarters.com/blog/2007/08/22/all-known-2007-toyot...undra-p
> http://www.tundrasolutions.com/forums/tundra/114436-tundra-tailgate-fa...res-i-a
> http://www.tundrasolutions.com/forums/tundra/113646-transmission-fault...entifie
> http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f1669aa
> http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/news/toyota/tundra/transmissions/page1.html
>
> I think you can find enough mention of problems to qualify as "peppering
> the internet with complaints."
>
> Ed
>
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C. E. White1

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Since: Apr 13, 2004
Posts: 332



(Msg. 11) Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:28 pm
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"Mike Hunter" wrote in message

> Really? Then why is it Toyota had more recalls than any other
> manufacturer in 2006 and again so far in 2007?

Mike, we covered this before. While it is true Toyota recalled the most
vehicles in 2006, it is not even close in 2007. GM, Ford, and Nissan have
all recalled more vehicles so far in 2007 than Toyota. I gave you the facts
and good references.

Ed
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dbu.

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Since: Oct 23, 2007
Posts: 4



(Msg. 12) Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 3:41 pm
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Mike Hunter

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Posts: 1536



(Msg. 13) Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 6:52 pm
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The fact remains Toyota had the most RECALLS. Wink

mike

"C. E. White" wrote in message

>
> "Mike Hunter" wrote in message
>
>> Really? Then why is it Toyota had more recalls than any other
>> manufacturer in 2006 and again so far in 2007?
>
> Mike, we covered this before. While it is true Toyota recalled the most
> vehicles in 2006, it is not even close in 2007. GM, Ford, and Nissan have
> all recalled more vehicles so far in 2007 than Toyota. I gave you the
> facts and good references.
>
> Ed
>
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C. E. White1

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Since: Apr 13, 2004
Posts: 332



(Msg. 14) Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:34 pm
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"Mike Hunter" wrote in message

> The fact remains Toyota had the most RECALLS. Wink
>
> mike

That is not true either. I provided you with a complete list 2007 Toyota
recalls. Strictly speaking "Toyota" only has three recall campaigns in
2007:

Sept 26 - NHTSA # 07E082000 - 2007 and 2008 Camry and Lexus ES350 Floor Mats
(an equipment recall, not a vehicle recall) - approximately 55,000 vehicles
affected

Jan 19 - NHTSA # 07V013000 - 2004 to 2007 Sequoias and 2004 to 2006
Tundras - lower ball joint recall - 533,124 vehicles affected

Jul 24 - NHTSA # 07V324000 - 2007 Tacoma 4WD Pickup - propeller shaft - 108
vehicles affected

There are three more recalls for aftermarket components installed in Toyotas
(in some cases installed by Toyota dealers or distributors):

Jan 16 - NHTSA # 07E005000 - Scion XA and XB - aftermarket cruise control
(not installed by Toyota) - 2934 vehicles affected

Jan 25 - NHTSA # 07V030000 - Scion XA and XB - Gulf States installed cruise
control - 1372 vehicles affected

Jan 16 - NHTSA # 07V048000 - Scion XA and XB - Southeast Toyota installed
cruise control - 716 vehicles

As far as I can detemrine that is the complete list of 2007
"Toyota/Lexus/Scion" US Recalls. In the last five months of 2007 (May to
September) DiamlerChrysler (now Chrysler) has had 13 recalls:

May 2007 - 07V-192 - DaimlerChrysler is recalling 270,958 MY 2005 Town and
Country and Dodge Caravan minivans

May 2007 - 07V-196 - DaimlerChrysler is recalling 410 MY 2007 Dodge Caliber,
Jeep Compass and Patriot passenger vehicles

June 2007 - 07V-240 - DaimlerChrysler is recalling 798 MY 2007-2008 Sebring
and MY 2008 Dodge Avenger vehicles.

June 2007 - 07V-246 - DaimlerChrysler is recalling 39 MY 2007 Dodge and
Freightliner Sprinter 2500 and 3500 trucks.

June 2007 - 07V-247 - DaimlerChrysler is recalling 5,062 MY 2007 Dodge Ram
1500 pickup trucks

July 2007 - 07V-291 - DaimlerChrysler is recalling 80,894 MY 2007 Jeep
Wrangler and Dodge Nitro vehicles.

July 2007 - 07V-299 - DaimlerChrysler Manufacturing is recalling 4,433 MY
2001-2006 Dodge Sprinter and Freightliner Sprinter 2500 and 3500 trucks

July 2007 - 07V-325 - DaimlerChrysler Manufacturing is recalling 461 MY 2007
Dodge and Freightliner Sprinter 2500 and 3500 trucks.

September 2007 - 07V-413 - DaimlerChrysler is recalling 1,498 MY 2007
2-wheel drive Dodge Ram pickup trucks

September 2007 - 07V-414 - DaimlerChrysler is recalling 72,333 MY 2007-2008
Avenger sedan and Chrysler Sebring convertible vehicles.

Septemeber 2007 - 07V-415 - DaimlerChrysler is recalling 28,755 MY 2007-2008
Jeep Grand Cherokee and Commander sport utility vehicles

September 2007 - 07V-426 - DaimlerChrysler is recalling 1,158 MY 2008 Dodge
Avenger all wheel drive vehicles.

Septemeber 2007 - 07V-434 - DaimlerChrysler is recalling 296,550 MY 2007
Dodge Nitro, Jeep Wrangler, and MY 2006-2007 Grand Cherokee and Commander
sport utility vehicles.

Ford, GM, Nissan, VW, Volvo, and Suzuki have all had more individual recall
campaigns than Toyota so far in 2007. So to be clear - Toyota has not
recalled the most vehicles in 2007 and Toyota has not had the most recalls
in 2007.

Mike you need to stop making stuff up. It hurts your credibility when you
actaully are stating true facts.

Ed

> "C. E. White" wrote in message
>
>>
>> "Mike Hunter" wrote in message
>>
>>> Really? Then why is it Toyota had more recalls than any other
>>> manufacturer in 2006 and again so far in 2007?
>>
>> Mike, we covered this before. While it is true Toyota recalled the most
>> vehicles in 2006, it is not even close in 2007. GM, Ford, and Nissan have
>> all recalled more vehicles so far in 2007 than Toyota. I gave you the
>> facts and good references.
>>
>> Ed
>>
>
>
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rantonrave

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Since: Jul 16, 2007
Posts: 12



(Msg. 15) Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:54 pm
Post subject: Re: Tundra owners grumble over rumble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Mike Hunter wrote:
>
>"badgolferman" wrote in message
>
>
>>I'm not completeley surprised by all this quality slipping news coming
>>out lately. Although I am still a Toyota loyalist I have personally
>>noticed the quality of the controls, road noise, inside material and
>>other non-essential parts. All Toyotas I have owned since my 1994
>>Camry just don't measure up in feel or driving experience.
>>
>>All that said I would still choose a Toyota over almost any brand just
>>because everything under the skin and cabin lasts for such a long time
>>without needing repair.
>
>Really? Then why is it Toyota had more recalls than any other manufacturer
>in 2006 and again so far in 2007?
>
Probably because they introduced more all-new designs around that time
than other manufacturers did. Recalls are related more to new designs
than overall quality, as Chrysler and AMC showed in the 1970s, when
they sometimes had the lowest recall rates in the industry, along with
the oldest designs. Contrary to what Toyota claims publicly, the
quality and efficiency of their North American factories are not as
good as their Japanese factories', and the designs never produced in
Japan have fared worse than the other Toyotas.
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